Dan and Allen's X-Controller Experiences

@AllenMassey and @DanBrown can you summarize for me what you view as the difference between running the X-Controller and the g-shield/arduino stack from a benefit standpoint in your mind.

If in your mind there is no benefit that is fine. I’d be perfectly comfortable with you writing back it’s not better or it’s the same. I know what I think it is based on my experience with it in our shop and conversations with Bart. I’m curious to hear what you think after getting to play with it for a bit.

Also if you don’t feel comfortable posting it publicly on the forum you can PM me directly.

Hey, I’ve got no problem with talking about it right here in the community! This is where I’ve learned to build and use it, this is where I’ll share what I can. :smile:

Functionally, as far as the x-carve’s operation goes, I do not see that much of a difference. It worked well before, it works well now. There would likely be a far greater operational advantage for a heavier CNC unit, or one using larger steppers, given the bigger, more powerful stepper drivers.

The major advantages I see:

1: Installation. The header crimping and soldering of the header to the G-shield was the most “technically complex” part of the X-carve assembly, and required the most skill on the part of the assembler. I had done PCB soldering and crimp fittings of that sort before so it was not a major challenge to me, but someone who had not might easily have had difficulty. The X-Controller’s very clear, simple labeling of the plugs, and screw-down terminals make that job the work of minutes with a screw driver instead, and there’s no longer any question of wiring order in the header, particularly. Additionally, the only part of my X-Carve that required any modification to assemble properly was the housing for the Arduino / G-shield. On mine, I had to cut an eighth inch or so of the window bottom away to allow the header to stand clear of the wall, and the G-shield to seat correctly. Problem solved!

2: Individual grounds. Following up on #1, one of the more standard things that I’ve seen and that I personally experienced with the stock set-up is the number of wires that need to go into a single ground connection. Splicing several together to a single wire, then installing that one seems to be the common solution to the problem. Again, soldering and some level of technical knowledge is required. Again, eliminated by the clearly-labeled X-Controller ports and the designated grounds for each connection.

3: Serviceability. Having the Arduino and G-shield either not properly connected together, or coming loose seems to be another common point of failure. Integrating them both into a single unit cleanly eliminates that problem.

4: Integrated E-stop. This has already saved me a couple times during setup, and is much easier to use than hitting the switch. These can easily be put in-line, but having it right on top of the controller, right next to the X-carve is tremendously handy.

5: Stability. The old control unit, as it was provided, had an extreme tendency to wander around on whatever surface you set it on. It rested only on a pair of screw heads, and the smooth metal base of the PSU. I added rubber feet to mine, which helped to an extent, but it still had a propensity to walk on the bench over time. Not so, the X-controller. Where you set it, there it will stay!

6: Professionalism. This doesn’t really matter much, except in a rare few situations, but it sure looks a LOT more professional. No more rats-nest of wires going into three sides of a stack of differently-coloured, miss-matched boxes randomly. Now it is all neatly lined up in rows, in plugs, and all to one side, meaning you can set this somewhere with the face exposed, and not have a tangle of cables in all directions. And it all goes into a single, professionally-anodized and silk-screened enclosure. It looks like a professional unit, instead of a home-build.

7: Power. Having all of the steppers driven off of their own separate drivers with plenty of juice means no fiddling around with your G-shield pots to get your NEMA-23s to stop staggering from a low-current condition. This one just works, right out of the box, no fidgeting.

8: Expansion. I can’t speak to this one directly yet, as I have not actually had a chance to install and run the AC Relay Box (planned for this weekend), but having the capability to directly control external devices right off of the control unit adds a tremendous amount of functionality. I’ve come up with quite a number of potential uses for that, ranging from the obvious AC relays, to solenoids controlling pneumatic clamping or linear actuators. How neat would, say, having your enclosure automatically close, and your dust collection and spindle come on by themselves, controlled in the code? And having a proper connection for the Z-probe is very nice!

I’m sure I will think of more as I go along, but those are the ones that popped to mind immediately. I really am enjoying it!

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Here’s a stop that can be mounted on the front of your bench

Since these are being sold as an all in one unit, I assume that they will have full regulatory testing e.g. UL listed etc ?

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That’s a good switch, too. It’s the exact one I have on my router table, and I’m planning to fit one of them to my table saw very shortly as well. I really like being able to bump it with my knee, without having to take my hands off of the workpiece. Nice thing about E-stops is that you can just plug together as many of them as you would like. :smile:

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Dan really summed it up nicely.

I would just amplify his points about ease of setup. It is much easier to setup than the gshield, due to the labeled connectors and the larger screwdown connections (the wires actually fit into the connectors).

The entire system is also much more stable, with the the gshield/Arduino I was constantly watching to be sure nothing on the workbench was pushing it around. The wire connections were fragile, as long as nothing moved they worked, but I always hated moving anything for fear it would break. With the new X-Controller I no longer have those worries at all. Everything is much more solid and robust.

As Dan also points out, knowing that the motors finally have all the power they need is a great advantage. That makes a huge difference when using a router like the 611 which is capable of much more aggressive speeds and depth of cut. But it can only perform as well as the motors are capable of pushing it around.

The accessories connections are probably the best part of the X-Controller. Have a dedicated and labeled connections for the touch probe and two accessories is a real advantage. Just having the touch probe working is already saving me time. It is also really nice to have auto start/stop control on the 611. I was surprised by how much better that makes the carving experience. Now I don’t worry as much if I walk away for a few minutes knowing that the router will turn off when the job is complete.

The only thing I don’t like as much as Dan in the integrated E-Stop. While it is nice to have, it really limits how the X-Controller can be located. I would really like to move the controller to a slide out shelf under the workbench to free up some of my workbench space. But the E-Stop configuration prevents that. I understand that with the 110V wiring there are safety issues moving the switch outside of the case. But I think there are other solutions, one alternative would be to mount the E-Stop on top of the AC relay box and have the X-Controller plug into the AC relay box. Then the E-Stop would kill power to the Spindle, the X-Controller and all accessories that were plugged into the AC relay box.

But my issue with the E-Stop is pretty minor compared to the all the other advantages.

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If I might chime in here…

I too have been beta testing the X-Carve, but treated it as though there was an NDA just out of habit. After seeing @Zach_Kaplan chime in here and the good responses I’ve seen from others reading about the X-Controller I don’t see much of a problem speaking up.

All in all, I have had much the same experience as @AllenMassey and @DanBrown. I eco pretty much all of what they have said so far.

From my experience with the X-Controller, I can say that it is definitely a worthy upgrade from the standard setup and I might even go so far as to say that it should be the standard setup in the future and if someone wanted to go with the older version then they would need to specifically request it somehow (possibly choosing it as a “downgrade” to save money). For new purchasers of the X-Carve that are starting out fresh, this addition brings it a few more steps closer to “plug it in and it just works”.

The X-Controller does away with a lot of things I thought about when putting together the X-Carve. I had no real issues with the way it went together and was able to think about and solve any problems that came up, but in the back of my mind at the time I thought, “hmmm… if I didn’t have some of the experience that I have, some of this stuff might seem a little more daunting or at least a little more frustrating to others with less experience.”

The plug/unplug ability for the new setup if nice as well. I have tested the X-Controller in 4 different locations even rerouting my side drag chain front to back in order to try out different options that others might consider, and while normally someone wouldn’t unplug and move their controller very much, it is super simple to do with the way the X-Controller is set up. For those that might move their 500mm version or take it around to different places, this it the controller for you.

One thing I have noticed that @DanBrown picked up on is that movement of the X-Carve is not only more powerful, but smoother to some degree. That may be due to the extra Y-axis stepper driver, and it may also be due to the upgraded stepper driver chips, or it may be a combination of those and a few other things. Either way it is a nice added bonus. :smile:

Like I said, my experience with the X-Controller has very closely mirrored what @DanBrown and @AllenMassey have posted here, and I agree with a lot of what they have to say. Just a little more reinforcement in favor of the X-Controller.

Before (much more “permanent”)

After (much more modular)

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Oh, and one other thing I forgot to mention! It’s quieter than the stock controller. My stock one had kind of an annoying habit of making a metallic “buzz” from the top of the Arduino case rattling against the bottom when it was powered up. I ended up fixing that by adding a very tiny piece of rubber to one of the corners when I closed the lid, it provided enough vibration dampening and upward pressure to suppress the noise. The X-controller has only a very smooth fan-hum when it’s running, no obnoxious rattle at all.

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Dan and Allen, have you tried to change the microstepping to 1/16th, and if so did it improve performance in any way?

I have not changed it from the default. Inventables sets the defaults with each step for the X and Y divided into 8 microsteps and the Z divided into 2 microsteps.

It can be set at 16 microsteps but then the movement speed would be reduced. So it is a trade off between additional accuracy and speed. I think the defaults are a pretty good balance.

I have not fiddled with it myself, so far I’ve been entirely pleased with the smoothness of motion using the existing settings. I might give it a shot at some point, though. :smile:

Ok, thank you for your replies. The reason I asked is that these microsteps are listed as a “feature” of the x-controller by Inventables. It would be interesting to know whether this feature actually gives you any advantages.

Is the motor wire shielded ? If so, what is going on with the shield for the motor wire , where is that being connected ?

@AllenMassey @DanBrown @sketch42

Now that you all have been using the X-controller for a little while are there any updates or changed impressions you would be willing to share beyond your initial thoughts?

Thanks

Other than my initial thoughts, I don’t have much to add. The touch probe is pretty nice and has been working reliably.

I will say that the X-Controller has been running well and reliably. It’s build quality and design will mean that at this rate it will last a nice long time in my shop. Overall, I’m pleased that my carving only got better with the X-Controller and with regular use, it hasn’t given me any problems so far.

If I hadn’t been given a test unit, I would still have bought one when it becomes available, and wouldn’t have any regrets doing so.

The more that I have used the X-Controller the more I like it. It is very solid, well engineered, easy to setup and most importantly it is very reliable. The only small change I would make would be to move the power switch from the end with all the connectors to somewhere on the top so it is not in the middle of all the connection wires. Once the X-Controller is setup the only time I touch it is to turn the power on or off so making that switch easier to reach would be nice, but really that is a small thing compared to how well it has been working.

I am also very impressed with the AC relay box that will connect to the X-Controller. Being able to have auto start/stop for the Dewalt and the dust collector is very nice.

The only thing I would change would be to add to the AC relay box would be a two position switch that would allow one of the outlets to be placed into either “AUTO” mode where the outlet is controlled by gcode commands and a “ON” mode where the outlet is powered when the switch is in the ON position.

Then I would be able to have the dust collector turn off when the job completes and still be able to easily turn it back on to clean up parts when I remove the clamps.

The Arduino (~$25 US), the gShield (~$50 US), a 24 volt power supply (~$25 US) and say $30 US for an E-stop and electronics case gives a controller solution for about $130 US.

The X-Controller is priced at about $330 US.

Do you think that the added convenience of the X-Controller is worth $200 US?

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Based on the pricing Inventables has posted the Grbl Shield, Arduino, enclosure, power supply and the power Supply PCB is about $196. The X-Controller which replaces all that is $329. So by my math the X-Controller upgrade should add about $133 to the total cost.

I think it is well worth $133 incremental cost.

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Well, that brings up another point. The Arduino/gShield is open hardware which brings the price down and the X-Controller is proprietary.

Saying the X-Controller is proprietary is like saying a Gecko system is proprietary. It’s just powering and driving… You could probably get the X-Controller to work with any stepper motor driven machine with moderate power requirements. It’s more of a complete package, like a Gecko or PlanetCNC system. The X-Carve will work with them as well.

With the extra stepper output and modular design it seems like a good value.

EDIT: Sorry… I misunderstood your meaning. Yes, the internals are proprietary, but the added capabilities make it comparable to other controllers like Gecko, etc.

The bottom line is with the addition of the X-Controller, owners may not feel the need to upgrade the control system to one of the others.

It is nice to have a packaged up product and it will certainly move the X-carve a minor step in the direction of plug and play, but I just think that it is overpriced for what it does. I have some issues with the specifications which I have discussed with the company.

I think that for many it’s a great product and I just wanted some other opinions on the value of the conveniences.