Upgraded Z-Axis Design

I don’t really see how Phil is making snide comments?

I have not and will not be buying a Zplunge, but I read the thread out of interest, and I’m assuming Phil (and anyone else that isn’t a current or future customer) does too.

Also “righting mistakes at his expense” is the only thing any business should be doing, regardless if it’s a massive company or a one man band

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@PhilJohnson I did say he made a few comments. He’s also doing what we’d all expect him to do to remedy the situation and right the mistakes.

Phil, I completely agree, and I hope he does comment on this so we can move on and forward.

Are the rails coated or protected at all or just raw steel? Unprotected steel will corrode even when exposed to just plain shipping environments (humidity, altitude, temperature, etc). Bob lives in Hawaii, a hot and humid place that also adds salinity to the humidity. If the steel is unprotected, normal shipping can cause this. That’s why usually you have black oxide coated parts or stainless parts.

Corrosion is a beast that has to be considered when designing any product.

The rods are coated with a thin layer of synthetic PTFE grease (specifically this one) The rods on my machine showed no sign of corrosion even with no additional application of grease after assembly and the use of water-based mist coolant during machining.

I did perform deliberate destructive testing on sample rods to gauge the level of corrosion. A completely de-greased rod left in tap water had some very light surface rust but aside from light discoloration was completely smooth after being wiped off. I did not see any corrosion on the test rod treated with protective grease during my test.

As per the forum admins’ request I have been avoiding publicly posting anything related to individual transactions on this thread. It would only be right that I posted the harassment and threats that I previously received but I will forego that for now. I expect this post and the previous troll posts to be deleted by the admins in due time. For now since they don’t seem to be available, I will address this issue.

@PhilJohnson I do not at the moment.

I will give a certain member the benefit of the doubt and refund his shipping, even though the cost for me to replace the damaged parts will exceed the cost of the shipping fee. I ask that anyone who has created posts with personal attacks please remove them. If you have any feedback or requests regarding this design, please feel free to post it. If you want to brag about how great of an engineer you are and how your $300 product is going to be so much better than my < $150 product, please create your own thread.

I like that idea! I’ll give some thought to the specific offset that would be optimal, but offhand 30mm sounds like it would get me into a very good ballpark even with my slightly raised rails

At the risk of getting sucked into the rather heated discussion, I’m just going to offer my own experience as another data point. Not trying to challenge anyone else’s experience or opinions, just saying…As one of the recipients of a unit from the first batch, I’ve been in (private) contact with Kyle since the day it arrived and he’s been cooperative every step of the way and taking every reasonable step to make everything right.

Assuming the suckit fits, and rigidity is maintained, having both a higher option for max z clearance, and an offset plate option has some advantages.

As has been my experience as well.

The difference is they weren’t threatening to commit chargeback fraud if the replacement didn’t get there fast enough for their preference. Since you can’t seem to stop trolling I’m going to post the conversation and let people judge for themselves.

I have highlighted what I interpreted as threats to commit chargeback fraud.

Here I’ve magnified it for you.

It’s not a threat for chargeback fraud. You sold a product advertised as X and delivered Y. It’d be like ordering a green shirt on Amazon and getting a blue one.

ive delivered a product exactly as advertised and still had chargebacks and returns and bad feedback. It’s an unfortunate reality for ecommerce. On Amazon, I’ve had to eat both the product and the refund cost and that happens WAY more often than it should. I had a customer submit three orders and then do charge backs on all three orders and then place more orders. Luckily the charge back process is defensable and I won those cases.

I’ve tried to be helpful for you and be unbiased because you had a good thing going. I steered you away from Amazon because it’s a beast and if something goes wrong, it’s an almost immediate boot. But honestly, posting that whole conversation reflects much worse on you. Your customer service needs quite a bit of work and it’s a real classless move when he ordered a new unit and you have the thank you note say “Thanks for your order, THIEF”.

Your point of the Tormach differs here, they’re offering a new part with a proper design, you’ve been offering a hacked design to correct a mistake.


Well this thread has kinda gone down hill. Is there a fixed product yet? Is there a plan to continue making these after the problems above?

What is the status of the new spindle holder?
Do you have a ship date?

and let people judge for themselves

Bob made a reasonable offer to request a new unit before returning the first one. If you were unwilling, he was within his rights of the payment method to call PayPal for a chargeback.

I cannot find a justification for the sellers response to the buyer, or choice in publicizing their interaction to the whole forum.

This ought to have been resolved privately. if needed mediation from a forum moderator or inventables staff or even a jury of Bobs peers who frequent the forum.

These kind of shenanigans jeopardize other people from selling future product on this site.

@JDM can you please work with the other moderators to amend the forum bylaws on how for-sale items will be arbitrated in the future? I don’t see how this is going to be resolved without the forum admins stepping in.

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My order has shipped and will be arriving Monday. i will post back.

Wow this thread has really died. I am still interested in the product as long as the small issues so far get worked out and I see some good feedback on performance. Here’s to hoping for some good reviews.

I imagine if inventables have to get involved with problems arising from sales between members, we may see the end of the for sale section.

Getting involved in situations like this is I would guess the last thing they want to invest time in.
A couple of forums I used in the past dealt with this problem by removing the sale section altogether, which personally I would rather avoid

With bugs fixed this product should rock! Hoping this effort does not die out due to a difficult start.
I am certainly interested in the next iteration of this product!

Wow this thread has really died.

yep. not good news for the seller.

I would have considered purchasing if some new photos could be posted of a working piece. maybe @CoryBorgel can do the seller a service by posting some positive reviews…

I received my unit last Saturday. I haven’t posted yet because I haven’t had time to install it. Here are some pictures of the packaging. I have communicated directly with the seller and have been pleased so far with his responses. I will refrain from further review until I have it running. I’m not a CNC expert [yet] like some on the forum. I purchased this unit for upgraded rigidity, as I see the current z-axis as a big weak point in that respect. I don’t have any other modifications to my 1000x1000 latest gen X-carve.

The z-axis came sealed with a desiccant bag inside. Everything was neatly labelled. The contents were minorly different from the list in the one version of the manual posted in this thread (metal washers vs plastic spacer), but I’m sure he will update the manual to reflect that at some point. Thread locker and lube were provided in addition to all the necessary components. The only tools I see needing are allen keys, wrench for nuts, clamp of some sort (for holding the acme thread while tightening the nut at the top), and some alignment tool like a square. These tools would be the same as what you would have needed to assemble the stock x-carve.

I believe the mounting plate that was shipped with my package is not the ‘lower reaching’ one that has been discussed in this thread. This could be an issue for some to carve certain parts, but at this point I am giving Kyle the benefit of the doubt for correcting that in the near future.


Seller told me he was not going to post on this thread anymore. I got mine in and it does not allow bit to reach the stock surface. About a half inch too short. He is working on a new mount or something and should have it out soon to a couple of this. Said he was going to powder coat it first instead of anodize.