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The only response that I will even give is that I went back and reviewed my email correspondence with Laguna, 90%+ of the communications did not have the Confidentiality statement at the bottom as stated, Most just stated “Sent from my iphone”. I can always go back and edit/delete the information pertaining to these messages that do have the statements, even though I never agreed to the statements, however the story won’t change much at all bc the majority of the conversations did not have this “disclosure”. And the actual review of the machine and it’s pitfalls, speak for themselves.
“Confidentiality obligations generally arise via contract, such as by signing a non-disclosure agreement Contracts, as you likely know, require both parties to agree – what the law calls a “meeting of the minds.” Dropping a standard confidentiality disclaimer at the bottom of every company email doesn’t unilaterally impose on a recipient of an email a duty of confidentiality. It does not unilaterally bind the recipient to an agreement regarding the email footer language since you can’t unilaterally impose an obligation of confidentiality on someone. If they aren’t already obligated to keep the information you share with them confidential (e.g., due to having signed a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) or for some other reason), your email disclaimer isn’t going to change that – the recipient is free to do what they want with your email.”
Here is my quoted disclosure
“IMPORTANT DISCLAIMER: This email does not create an attorney-client relationship. Probably. If it does, it will have said it does … because the law is tricky like that…. The sender also concedes that he is very, very stupid, and obviously should not be operating an electronic-mail machine without supervision.”
Does anyone else find it to be a bit two-faced that a company would complain about a “confidentiality” request, yet not honor an agreement that is in writing?
I find it odd he joined a forum just to bash a customer that they did dirty. I don’t see this kind of thing anywhere else. If @StevenAlvarez was truly concerned with customer satisfaction. The last thing he would do is come here to make his already unsatisfied customer even angrier at them. IF they truely gave a s@“t we wouldn’t have this thread. I personally plan to never buy anything from Laguna tools.
I find it funny that they were still focused on margins when offering compensation. When they drop the ball this hard, margins should be the least of their worries. Especially when they were only 5% away from the initial request of 30%.
The quality here alone… I mean… come on… eat your margins and make it right. Worry about margins for the sale of a faulty product doesn’t make me feeeeel like they really want to make it right, just that they want to be done with it and stay ahead.
So it’s been three days and no response from @StevenAlvarez when he made a point to come here and throw fuel on the fire.
Well @StevenAlvarez came to tell the “other side of the story”, which he did not add ANYTHING that had not already been stated except trying to intimidate me by unilaterally trying to enforce a do not disclose / confidentiality statement that was not on nearly any of the communications. @StevenAlvarez tried to say
but of course they want to make sure that they still get the bigger piece of the pie even when they colossally Screw Up and even admit to it. How is that placing the customer first??? In my opinion, Laguna Tools thinks that their customers time and energy is WORTHLESS, bc they never once offered to compensate me personally for my time or energy that was lost/wasted while attempting to do business with them. Even an EVEN Exchange would have been a huge loss of my time and energy and there was still no guarantee that the new replacement machine would be even better than the first POS that Laguna Tools “mistakenly” shipped out, even admitting that it should have never made it through Quality Control, however it did and that was Laguna Tools mistake. Which has been one of many, one right after another and another and another… Laguna Tools apologies don’t compensate for my loss time or energy. I accepted the “compensation” only to TRY TO KEEP MY HEAD ABOVE WATER!!! That’s all that I could do and was my only option other than bending over and taking it like a champ. In all appearances, Like several here have pointed out, it seems Laguna Tools is more concerned about their margins than Customer Satisfaction even when it is obvious that Laguna Tools made a HUGE MISTAKE. My opinion is that Laguna Tools DEFINITELY is not a perfect company and in this case NEVER ONCE TRIED TO “PUT THE CUSTOMER FIRST”, only their own margins. Even if Laguna Tools broke even on this transaction it was at the Customers Expense!
What a JOKE!!! I had to fight to get compensated for the hunk of junk that Laguna Tools wasted my time and energy sending me even after they fully admitted that it should not have ever left their facility. And I still have yet to receive the spare tube that I “purchased”!!!
@StevenAlvarez I will apologize for having to write this review, how does that help you @StevenAlvarez ??? I should have never had to waste all of the time I spent on this one review alone.
@StevenAlvarez, I will also apologize for doing business with Laguna Tools, how does that help you @StevenAlvarez ???
@StevenAlvarez, I can keep apologizing for Laguna Tools mistakes, but I believe we all know what good that will do…
Now I want to ask you @StevenAlvarez , Now that I have apologized profusely for my actions, what actual good did it do for you??? Did it change ANYTHING??? I think not!!! Just wasted more time and energy.
So, I will not apologize for posting the TRUTH and My Full Experience here for, as you stated, “My Audience”, to read and become aware of the type of product and customer service one should/could come to expect from Laguna Tools!!!
@StevenAlvarez your company is always posting stories of how satisfied your customers are, I see them often on you tube, why don’t you post this one on You Tube for the world to know??? In your own words
If this is the case, why don’t you share this “successe story” with the world??? And let the “other side of the story” be Voiced!!!
Hey @StevenAlvarez, where is my spare laser tube??? Laguna Tools dropped the ball here not only on quoting the incorrect price, but also failing to deliver after promising to Honor this price and Taking My $$$$. @StevenAlvarez, why haven’t you Voiced that side of this story??? Laguna Tools won’t even respond to me in regards to this situation, but @StevenAlvarez wants to make sure that other side of the story has been Voiced!!! Where is that Voice??? Come on Speak Up!!!
You speak to my “audience”
Why would they even want to??? So you can waste their time and money with your dishonest business practices just to take advantage of their pocket books just like you did mine???
@StevenAlvarez, I keep trying to look at the world from your point of perspective, however I just can’t seem to do this,
(Sorry had to go back and crop the photo to remove the top header)
One thing that I TRUELY Appreciate from forums like this is that one small voice packs A LOT of Punch, that’s the beauty of Freedom of Speech and the exact reason why I would not sell my for the oddly offer that I received. So here’s my Theme song by AC/DC
See me ride out of the sunset
On your colour TV screen
Out for all that I can get
If you know what I mean
Women to the left of me
And women to the right
Ain’t got no gun
Ain’t got no knife
Don’t you start no fight
'Cause I’m T.N.T., I’m dynamite
(T.N.T.) and I’ll win the fight
(T.N.T.) I’m a power load
(T.N.T.) watch me explode
I’m dirty, mean, and mighty unclean
I’m a wanted man
Public enemy number one
Understand?
So lock up your daughter
Lock up your wife
Lock up your back door
And run for your life
The man is back in town
So don’t you mess me 'round
'Cause I’m T.N.T. I’m dynamite
(T.N.T.) and I’ll win the fight
(T.N.T.) I’m a power load
(T.N.T.) watch me explode
T.N.T., (oi, oi, oi), I’m dynamite
(T.N.T., oi, oi, oi), and I’ll win the fight,
(T.N.T., oi, oi, oi), I’m a power load
(T.N.T.), watch me explode!
So come on @StevenAlvarez I’m calling you back out. Come explain to my “Audience” why they should blatantly ignore the experience that I have posted and shared here and why they would want to even attempt to do business with Laguna Tools after this
I also want to point out that several of these reviews showed up AFTER I had already placed my order and were not available when I was doing my research. It is understandable for one or two bad reviews to be available for a company from time to time because nobody is “Perfect” however the poor reviews are starting to mound for Laguna Tools. In my opinion Laguna has not been “Victims”of poor reviews bc of disgruntled customers, it seems to look as if they are attempting to take advantage of unexpecting customers by selling sub-par machinery at premium pricing. Wether this is on purpose or by accident, I can’t be for certain but I can contest from my own personal experience that the Quality and Customer Service is very lacking in my opinion.
Michael,
Thanks so much for your in depth review. It was like reading a written version of the last year of my life. It had inspired me to write my own lengthy review of Laguna. I unfortunately purchased a much larger laser cutter. I made the same mistakes you did. I’ve also experienced the same, if not worse, customer service. My shop is less than 5 miles from Laguna’s Irvine HQ and I can not even get a tech out here to look at this thing. I too urge anyone shopping for lasers to avoid Laguna at all costs.
I too purchased a laser from Laguna in 2017. I ordered the EC 5x10 in April & after the inquiring several times finally got it in August. I immediately inquired about the fan exhaust button on the side after seeing it did nothing & was jokingly told it was a self-destruct button…it would’ve been nice if it was! My machine wasn’t equipped with any dust ports whatsoever to connect the ducting from the exhaust fans on the outside of the machine through the sides to the exhaust vents under the table. After weeks of waiting & being told replacement panels with the ports were on their way, it was finally concluded that no such ports ever existed. The final offer was to have me ship the panels back to Laguna so someone could modify my panels with the ports. I opted to do it myself, given how everything else got screwed up I knew if I sent them they too would never be seen again. I can fortunately say that the laser has performed well until today. I ran it for about 3 hours yesterday with no issues, today I went to run first program and got the following error - power 1 open circuit fault please check power output circuit. Curious if anyone else has had this pop up? I’m shut down until I have to call tech support tomorrow, which I’m dreading.
Thank you for chiming in and letting us know that you as well have not had a pleasant experience dealing with Laguna.
I can’t figure out exactly which model you purchased. However I assume that it came with the Ruida Controller? My assumption is it will have something to do with the connections at the Controller or the laser tube power supply. Check ALL of the connections to make sure all of them are secure and have not come loose or fallen out like some of the connections on my machine.
I had to completely revamp the power coming in and upgraded it to 220v so that I could use the “Self Destruct” button to operate the fan and also be able to power the chiller from the machine itself and not have to run a separate circuit for the exhaust and chiller. All of which should have been done at the factory in my opinion.
On a separate note, I just realized that Laguna has changed the machines up and redesigned them. With the new design also comes a higher price tag than last years model. Looks like the model that I purchased went up about $500. Hopefully Laguna has addressed their “Quality Control” with the new design but I would be extremely skeptical of ever doing business with them again after my first experience and can not recommend doing business with them either. They burned that bridge.
You might reach out to @StevenAlvarez. He stopped by here to throw in his 2 cents (the value of the boat anchor they sold me) and tell the “other side of the Story”. however as you can see he has not been back since he threw Fuel on the Fire.
I wish you luck dealing with them, however I can’t hold my breath after the experience that I have personally experienced with them. If you can’t figure out the problem with Tech Support, feel free to reach out again and myself and possibly others here will be more than happy to Assist you in getting it up and operating again instead of it being just a boat anchor.
In addition, PLEASE SHARE ANY UPDATES!!! I assume since yours went down, mine will eventually do the same thing that yours has just done. It will be nice to know how to address the situation before it happens.
I can’t thank you enough Michael for taking the time to write all these detailed reviews. I’m a university professor, and I have been looking at laser and was about to pull the trigger on this one, until finding your posts after a “Laguna MX 100watt review” good search. I’m so glad I did. I’ll be taking my 20k somewhere else…as I too was planning on buying both a laser and a cnc spindle. Bummer. But glad to find out in advance. I’ve heard nothing but great things about Epilog, but they’re priced much higher, so I was hoping this was a good option. Looks like I’m back to researching. Thanks again.
Epilog is amazing, wish I could afford one myself.
You might check into Thunder Laser or Boss Laser. Can’t tell you much about them but what I have seen their Quality Control could possibly be better than Laguna.
I wish I could afford an Epilog. My pockets aren’t that deep. I’m currently talking to Thunder. Thanks to you guys, that’s who I’ll likely be going with. It’s going to cost me a little more than the Laguna laser…but it sounds like the Laguna would have been a big disappointment.
I can not thank you enough for your review. I have been in the market for a laser for some time and ran across the Latina laser. Being a wood worker, I know their name well but have not purchased any of their tools.
Your review will keep me in that category, I have been looking at the Boss machines mainly but wanted to explore all options. I like others wish I could justify an epilog machine but just do not have the extra funds to toss their way.
I am sorry you went thru what you did, however you have saved me and others from the potential same fate.
Thanks lot Michael for this great piece of review. I have hard a good enough about Laguna tools but diving the long focus in this topic, I found much more knowledge regarding the laser cutter. Definitely it will be helpful for many guys here like me. I appreciate your time.
